Bare Bones Banter: Kevin White and Believe Crew

Welcome to an engaging episode of Bare Bones Banter with Chris, Sarah, and Becca from The Mental Funny Bone podcast. This week features an enlightening conversation with Kevin White, founder of the Believe Crew. Kevin shares the poignant personal experiences that led him to establish his coaching and consulting collective. The hosts delve into the essential values and methods that guide Kevin's work, including healing emotional wounds and empowering self-leadership. The episode combines humor, insightful discussions on the importance of continuous self-work, and explores how different spiritual and psychological insights such as chakras and human design can aid in personal growth. Listeners get a peek into Kevin's unique journey and the innovative ways his team supports their clients in uncovering their true gifts and purpose.

How to find mental health help when you're struggling. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/therapists
https://washingtoncountyhumanservices.com/agencies/behavioral-health-developmental-services
https://www.alleghenycounty.us/Services/Human-Services-DHS/Publications/Resource-Guides
Apps - Just search mental health where you get your apps.
EAP programs are a great place to look for help!!

Additional Resources (Sports Related):
https://globalsportmatters.com/health/2020/12/04/mental-health-resources-2/

Transcript

0:24

Hello and welcome to Bare Bones Banter with The Mental Funny Bone. I'm Chris, and I'm here as always with my sister, Sarah and Becca, the intern. And this week we have a special guest, uh, Kevin White, uh, the founder of Belief Crew. And Kevin is here to talk to us about his organization and how he got started and some of the things that he's interested in doing and, uh, and how that kind of relates to what we do at our podcast. Um, so you guys, I will give a quick intro about Belief Crew and then I have a series of questions to ask Kevin and, uh, you know, just to, just to give a little shout out to Becca and Sarah. Thank you for letting me do the talking at the beginning. It makes me feel very important. I appreciate it. You're doing such a good job. That's so much better than I ever do with a script.'cause I fumble over the script all the time. So you've killed it. You have now earned your spot as the Introducer. Introducer intro. Yeah. Think if I ever get good at jujitsu and I go to tournaments, that's what my name is gonna be. The introducer. Oh, you come out to the Music of Informer, right? Introduce sir. Okay. Enough singing. Enough singing. All right. Get serious. Be serious. We have company. You guys clean it up. All right. So Kevin, I'm gonna say some things about Believe Crew, and then you can correct me as we go on. All right. All right. So, uh, believe Crew is a coaching and consulting collective, uh, that helps individuals and leaders uncover, uh, limiting beliefs, heal emotional wounds, and step into empowered self leadership. Hmm. Love that. Good job. That sounds good. Yeah. Our friend, uh, our friend Chad helped us write that. Chad, GPT. Chad GPT. Yeah. Do, yeah. My wife tells me that, uh, if she could marry Chad GPT, she would, but, you know, at least I've, I'm glad that so far that's not possible. Yeah. I mean, eventually, eventually our, our age group. I think we're good. I think we're good. Uh, Becca, you might need to worry about it like being replaced by AI girlfriend. I'm actually listening to a podcast like, not right now in my head. I. In times when I'm not talking to you guys, I'm listening to a podcast about a guy who had a, a chat or a girlfriend, a a AI girlfriend, and got pretty serious. He brought her, he brought her the, the, the AI girlfriend on his phone. He brought her to meet his parents with his wife. There's with his wife. I mean, his wife is there. She's very supportive of the AI girlfriend. It just opens up a whole can of ethics that we didn't cover in college. Hold on, hold on. Right. This is a true story. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's one of a gajillion of'em. I would imagine like whole, whole sidebar. Um, Kevin, what happens is I, uh, we have the questions mm-hmm. And we look at the questions every once in a while, look over here at the questions and not notice that we haven't done a single question, so. Mm-hmm. It, it's an, it's an operation and professional distraction is what I'm understanding. Cool. I like it. Yeah. Yeah. That is, uh, that is exactly what we do here. Okay. Uh, so what we're going to try to do in this episode is get away, uh, from the ethics of having a, a girlfriend. In general, and when you're married, like there's a whole, there's, there's lots of unpack, unpack there that we're gonna somebody, some topics give over six months of episodes to do after this. Just on that, right? Just on that. That's, that's what our podcast is about now. Um, alright Kevin, so my first question, um, what was the spark or personal experience that led you to start the Believe crew? So what, what made you come up with the idea? What made you go all in on it and tell us the origin story, if you will. Sure. Well, man, it feels so serious, like the answer, like, I gotta give serious answers here. I don't know how to do this in a funny way. Um, we can be serious. It's okay. We'll look at us, we'll provide the funny look how serious we are. Uh, yes. I, I guess the really, one of the biggest impacts, uh, and I talk about it all the time, even share her story was, was my mother-in-law. Uh, honestly. Um, and that's why it's so seriously, she, Jamie and I, my, my wife who's also a co-founder, we, we founded the company together. Um, we, we had a year in 2006 and seven where we lost both of our moms and to cancer. And so, um, but really her mom, her name was Susan, um, was the one that we paid attention to as far as. Belief crew, and I suppose to a certain extent, they both, they both very much live in what we created together in belief crew. So they were the start. Is that, is that serious enough for you? I think so. Is Christy stuck? That is, that is definitely serious enough. No, she's back now. I see her, um, give me, my computer has gone absolutely bananas. Gimme one second. Christina's stuck. That's all right. Wait, can you guys hear me? That's a beautiful, beautiful thing though. That's also a beautiful thing. The fact that Yeah. See, told you you could bring as much serious as you want. We're not gonna that last long. Still going back to the laughs. Yep. That's good. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, I don't know if I, should I continue? Yeah, I, I, I have a question along, I mean, just I think going off kind of the same thing, um. Are we still recording though? Did she do we? Yes. We're still recording. Yes, we're Okay. So I'm continuing. Um, so how did you find yourself? I think I read, so you, you have a tech background. Yes. That's initially where you came from. So how, what happened that made that, what was the spark that you were Oh yeah. I'm totally gonna go from re restart your computer to restart your life. Like, oh yeah. I love that.'cause that's what I used to always tell my wife the most, and she hated it. Right? Yep. She's got, she's got like 40 tabs on her browser. Everything's open, you know, it's been that way for two weeks. Yeah. I recommend that she has to restart and she is, I hate it when you say that. Hate it. I hate it. Yes. Um, yeah, I think it's, no, it should be done once a month or so, I think, but yeah, I mean, I, you know, this is back in the windows, 95 days. No, just kidding. But, uh, yeah, uh, that's a good question. Well, I mean, really it became a necessity I would say. A couple things. One, I was, I was not very connected as an, as a tech person, right? I was. Mm-hmm. I was a dad who showed up in, in physical presence without connecting to anyone. And, um, at a certain point, Jamie made it clear that, hey, let's, let's shift it a little bit. Let's, let's have more fun here. And so then I started to un unravel. Go ahead. Yes. So I decided that I, I really wanna show up, right? Like, I wanna be present. I, we have six boys, so, um, oh my goodness gracious. So my oldest three, I don't know you guys aware, and, and of human design. Do you know what that is at all? No. Okay, let give it to us. All right. So he, so there's a, you know, in the personality profile area, there's so many, right? You've got the disc and the Myers-Briggs and you name it. There's so many. Um, and then there's some, like more, those, the, all of those pretty much say, okay, who are you from your own perspective? So you, we do the best we can to connect to what we really care about. Now those can all change. I mean, some of'em are better at, uh, than others at changing, but in particular, the disc, I've been every combination of the disc since I took it 20 years ago. Uh, because I've grown over, you know, I'm, I've become more connected to who I really am. And so I, they're, they're great for their, the way that they can be used. And they are changeable because we're people and we don't often know exactly who we are. At least some of us don't. Human design, and there's another one that's closely related to it. Gene keys are much more based on who are, who are you, not from your perspective, but rather from your birth time, from your, from the energetic space of the world, when, when you came to being all of that. Um, there's a lot more to it. It's not just astrological, it's Jewish mysticism on the, there's a bunch of things. I, I don't even know what, what they're, but the, mainly the, the goal is to give you more of your gifts and more of who you are. And so, how did I get on that? Oh, yeah, yeah. We talked a little bit about, or you told us a little bit how Jamie said, yeah, it's time for you to be present and this is where mm-hmm. This is where we landed, right? Yes. So from the standpoint of learning my own gifts and getting an understanding of what would it look like me to be a connected person. To not be a tech person that wants to show up as a hero every day. And I was a pretty good hero. I, I liked responding to crisis and I did good with that. And, um, I traveled well, things like that, that was all good. But yet I wasn't, I was just, uh, destination thinking, right? If I do this, then eventually I, I bring home the money and, um, eventually I'll be happy. And so, um, I, I got a coach and I had a mentor that was a healer and together both of'em are in their sixties and that's the setting, that's what started it. Awesome. I think that that is amazing. So we, we've been talking recently, at least I've been talking recently about it, you know, what it, what it means to, what it means to be the hero. Like,'cause that is a space I enjoy a lot at work, so. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I get to show up, I get to solve the problem. Yeah. I get to swoop in and everyone's like, oh, you did such a good job. Thank you, thank you. Mm-hmm. But it, what it, what it gets me in the end is, you know, burnout like mm-hmm. I don't wanna show up at three o'clock in the morning. I don't wanna miss my family vacation. I don't wanna not be able to be present any place else in my life except for what it takes to get somebody to tell me that I'm awesome at work. Like, that's just a tough place to be. And I think that's where a lot of people kind of start their journey of, you know, this isn't as much fun as it was 25 years ago. Like, I don't really need you to tell me I'm awesome these days. I really need to be able to go to Red Rocks. Unplug from, from being, being your hero for a bit. Yes. So that, that is, that is an interesting, it, it always surprises me how, how many coincidences happen in this podcast. Like the fact that you would start there for why you decided to, to take your journey is, is really interesting. Yeah. So Sarah, would I, did I interrupt you? I felt like I jumped over top of you again. Always. No, huh? No, I'm remembering. A lot of times the really great things, even in the movies right, are come from a really dark space. And that, that year, 20 14, 20 15, that was the hardest year of my life for sure. Um, we were having our fifth child and uh, I had the biggest project in the world and I was the lead on it. It was awesome project. But when you almost like feel guilty for even. Right at the end was when we had him, when we had Oren, our fifth one. And, um, it was hard to be there because it was, I was so worried about the team and the state of the situa of the, of the project. Right. So, I mean, I'm not gonna, neither no one's at fault for that. It was, it was, um, there was a lot of things that all of us learned. Yes. And that's, that was really my takeaway from the year Right. Is like, uh, well I needed a lot of wake up calls, so we, we had that. Yeah. Yeah. I can, I can, I can a hundred percent understand that. All right, so let's, let's dig a little bit deeper into kind of what, what you and what I've called in, in all of my notes, the crew. So when you, what matters the most to you guys? So when you are working with your clients, when you're building your kind of community, what core values are you always kind of returning to? So a lot of what we've been trying to do recently with our, with our self-help and with a lot of kind of learning how to grow as people has been based on figuring out our values is really hard. Like to kind of tie into Disc and Myers Briggs and all that. I'll give you a different personality depending on what I think you wanna hear. Yeah. Because I am, the brain on me gets that. I, I just want you to like me and if you want me to be an ENJM at C, then I'll be an EMJ, FKFC, whatever it is. You want me to, I'll answer in the way that it makes you like me. So what very in expressive influencer that, that knows how to navigate that all very easily. Yeah, that's exactly what I'm an expressive influencer. That will just be a little chameleon as long as at the end you say, what a great job I'm doing. I am a, yeah, I have a very specific need. Um, yeah. Mm-hmm. So what, when you are, when you're working with people and you're trying to get people to, to kind of go through that journey, what are the values that, that you, and, you know, Jamie's your wife, right? Mm-hmm. Yes. What values do you guys come back to, to kind of ground yourselves in, in mm-hmm. Helping ground people in their values, I think is what I'm asking. Yeah. Well, what we focus on is the sacred things about each person. Like honestly, there's a lot of things that we don't listen to about ourselves. And when we let ourselves go there and, and have those conversations, then we can start figuring out what we really want in life. We are right now. It's, it's interesting. I mean, we kind of have a mix of people, younger people, like in their thirties that are interested. Some of those maybe will turn into clients, but most of our clients are actually in their late fifties or or early sixties. And what they've, they usually have a business, which is kind of our space. We work with entrepreneurs and they, uh, they have something they wanted to do with their life, but they haven't got there entirely, not to their own satisfaction at least. That doesn't mean they haven't been successful from a monetary standpoint or something else, but they, they, they always wanted to do something. And now that. There's a time clock ticking a little bit. They, they want to figure that out. And that includes actually a coach of my, the original coach of mine. He, he wants to, I hope, I think he'll be fine with me sharing that. He wants to do more speaking. He wants to get his, he actually would be a great radio host. He, he started in radio in the eighties. Um, and yeah, so he, he, he, we came to him, he helped us and now we're helping him work through that. So there's to, to go down that road, we need to understand a whole different set of things and what you learned in college. We need to know, um, a lot more about your spiritual gifts, which is human design. And uh, Jean Keys will help you do those. Or free pro profiles you can do online. Um. Now human design is a monstrous situ, like go talk to a certified person. I'm not even certified. I use it a lot, but I have no clue what it really says. Um, so there's a lot of complication to that. Gene case is much easier to understand. But there's it, those profiles give you more about what are the gifts that you bring to the table. And we have natural gifts that we see and, and, and understand all the time, like people that run fast and people that are funny and all that, right? And then there's this other, those things matter very much. And there's this other side of our gifts portfolio that we don't pay attention to. And that could be healing or it could be, uh, I mean you can use all kinds of different. Approaches to look at what those gifts are. There's, there's one profile that's fine, fairly new, um, from the table group in near San Francisco and in California it's called the Working Genius that doesn't really deal with spiritual gifts, but they get pretty close in a personality profile. They, they teach you about the gift that you bring to work and, um, for example, and that helps us start to think about, okay, so there's a process to work. How do I fit into that? Uh, that's one example. Um, but just diving into that and who am I, what gifts do I really have? And what is my, what is the thing that's so deep in my heart and my soul that I wanna do? Like if, if we, if our approach is to build something and do something repetitively to cope in life and then to retire and suddenly be happy. I don't think that works. And I think pretty much all of us that are under 50 or so don't have no interest in that really deep down, if we're really honest at all. And that's what we're being sold. And so we're helping people get away from that. No, I've really, I really like the idea of what, what, what gifts do, what gifts do I bring. It's a, it's a question that I've had to answer over and over and over and over again in, in my career. And Sarah, I don't, I don't know about you and, and Becca as you start your journey. Like, why, why am I gonna take this job? And at the beginning I will take that job because I am starving and I would like a place to live. Yeah. Yeah. And if I don't take this job, I will have to continue to work at Cinnabon at the mall. It's really still why I have the job that I do. I mean, I still, I'm having a lot of trouble right now doing like my, my, um, developmental plan thing and my goals and shit, because I'm literally, my goal is to not get fired. Like I, I feel that and I show up to get paid. That's literally the extent of my job. I don't know, like that's, yeah. Anyway, yeah. I mean, so my day job, that's, I've never really found, um, a day job where I was able to get into what I really felt was my gift, but that's why I am doing my side job now, so, yes. Which, I mean, for many Americans, that's, that's where it is right now is so many people have a side gig of some type that's really their, where their heart is. And then how do you turn that into something that supports you? That's, that's the hard part. Yeah. That's where the, that's the secret sauce. Does that make sense? Secret sauce, I think a secret sauce. There is secret supplies, secret. It's, uh, cheese sauce. Like it always goes, it always cheese sauce. Yeah. But I, I mean that's where, that's, that's where I am now is, is figuring out and mm-hmm. Trying things out and what's gonna make it work to be what I actually do, which I know years off of that, but mm-hmm. Um, I can say that this is possible. This is the work I'm doing. Mm-hmm. On the side. And I don't know if I mentioned Kevin in an email to you. Uh, I'm starting my own coaching business, so that is just. It's ridiculously fulfilling and I haven't even made a cent yet. So it's just, and it, it came from this podcast and it came from getting feedback from our listeners and having an impact. And that filled a little bit of my heart in a way that I never experienced before. Mm-hmm. And that's how kind of my journey started in that. Um, but I, I, I feel there's a lot of us that are in that same space. Yes. Yep. Yes. Cici was just lucky to have a, have a job that. She actually liked to do from a young age.'cause she's weird. I mean, but, but you, you still have to figure out who you are in this job. Yes. So, uh, Kevin, I do clinical research, so, you know mm-hmm. I was pretty fortunate to be able to really see some amazing things happen, like get involved with companies where they're using gene therapy to make little kids here. I mean, I'll continue to talk about that until I die. That was the most amazing ask. You should, like, how, how do you, how do you beat that? Like, continue to be involved with, with these things where you feel and. Sometimes it's, it's not really fun. Like earlier today, I could have throat punched, um, somebody who is really trying to do good, good work, but not in the way that I want them to do good work. Mm-hmm. But, you know, you, you have to find a way to, and this kind of gets into my next question. You, you have to find a way to bring who you are to your work and get, get something back in return. And I think that that's where, that's where a lot of people are, are looking at and being like, no, I don't wanna show up every day and I don't wanna update the project plan and I don't wanna. I don't wanna do the risk log. What's up Sarah? Me, me, me. That's, you don't, I don't care how No. I wanted to say, like you said, bring, bring you and your talents or however you just worded it. And, um, the second, uh, quarterly wellness newsletter went out to the company. Yes, Kevin. I work in it. Oh, me. Yeah. That's what I did for 25 years. Yeah. And my, uh, my boss during my last review wanted to know, what, what drives you? What do you wanna do? I was like, I wanna help people and not with computers. Mm-hmm. And so one of the things I, I pitched was. Some sort of wellness newsletter that goes out to the whole company. Well, just to our group really. And it ended up, I, it goes out to the whole company. So I, I sweet sent out my, my second one and got a lot of good feedback. So, and my boss today commented on it in our meeting and said that, yeah, it might not be it, but it's a great visibility. Yeah. You're a few people. Maybe you're a future people officer. There you go. Yeah. Mm. That still seems way too corporate-y, but, okay. Well, it's kind of the idea of having coaching in, in, uh, I am sure there's all kinds of different flavors, right. But there's, there is, there are coaches that do focus in corporate. Yeah. And, and even small business, if that's where you're at, you know. For sure. Sorry. Si. I, I interrupted. I was just excited. Yeah, that's alright. I lost my, my newsletter. I was just gonna, I was just gonna validate my own personal decisions, uh, to, to not, uh, operate a side business and say like, you can find what you need, uh, if you're willing to frame your mind in the right way inside of a, inside of a structure. But you have to find a place where you can give yourself to it. Where I can get on the phone with somebody who works with me and be like, Hey ass hat. Let's, let's settle down and figure out what we're gonna do. I have to be someplace where that's gonna be an acceptable start to a meeting. Hmm. What the hell is going on? I am, I am never gonna be super successful at a, at a corporation where realness isn't tolerated. And it took me a long time to kind of get there from where I started in. Only in the past couple years have I been like, if that's how the work gets done, and that's how I bring forward momentum to something, then that's just as valid as the person who writes a very, uh, formal, very tight, very succinct email. Like, these are two, uh, two flavors of how we get stuff done. And you just have to find the right place for the way that you're gonna do it. And even though I didn't have, even though I didn't have a coach, I had you and I had the podcast and I had, uh, I had, I had you to tell me all along that what you're doing is fine. Like what you're doing is fine. That's. Even though we didn't realize that it was coaching, it was exactly coaching. So even though I didn't have a formal coach, I did have you and the podcast and you know, eventually Becca to kind of push me in a direction where I was cool and okay with being who I am at work. Yeah, I think that's kind of the point of everything we did, everything we're doing. Tying it back into, into the mental health and the mental wellness kind of piece of it, a lot of it was kind of making peace with who I am as a, as a spicy neurodivergent person. Like even though I look perfectly normal on the outside, inside, inside, don't get yourself so much credit. Isn't she terrible, Becca? Isn't she awful? Imagine growing up with it, like the therapy, you literally were like, Hey, you literally were like, Hey, set me the ball. And I did know, and you were like, or no, you set me the ball and I just killed it. That's what it was. Lambed it down, right? That was awesome. I sure did. Okay, go ahead. Anyway. Like, sorry. So let's talk about people on some sort of spectrum. Right. Um, what I see when I talk to them is very gifted people, super gifted that I, there's this one kid that I, that I love talking to, and he, um, he sees people that are missing, you know, probably they died, uh, most likely he sees them and, and other things that are normal for them for, I wouldn't say challenged, I would say gifted. And that's, that's the way it's been for, for someone that is dyslexic. Is often a good business owner. And my father-in-law is, uh, definitely dyslexic and he's worth a lot of millions, you know? And, um, so he's a good entrepreneur. He's, he does that pretty easily, other than the typical fear that all of us would have. Right. Um, so yeah, I think, I think we have an opportunity to look at things a little differently with the information that we have today. And, um, I, I should warn people though, when you go down this road, if you're gonna say, okay, I'm gonna figure my calling out, suddenly what we're really signing up for is that the things that are, that matter the most to us, they might include different people. They might include, like, we live in Mexico last year, at the beginning of, um, uh, January, beginning of 2004. We decided that we were gonna move to Mexico in a space of two hours because of a conversation we had. And because we just felt within that two hour period that we needed to do that as part of our business. And we went down and told our boys, we had, you know, a seven bedroom house. I had everything that I ever dreamt of, definitely had exceeded my expectations for life from a, you know, having things standpoint. And then we had, then we had the opportunity to, uh, to figure out how to give that all away and, and, uh, sell our house and, and leave the US not permanently obviously, but, but, um, move in. We call it seven bedrooms. The seven suitcases. So I'm not saying that's the path for everyone, but I do think it's good to warn people that you're signing up for the things that matter most to you. That doesn't usually mean where you are right now. And the people that you're with right now and the setting that, and some of the things that you think really matter to you right now, you're asking for something different, and that's what we'll get. I think that's one of the hardest things. Yeah. I mean, we and I, well, I think it's hard to explain that, and I think it's hard. That's the hardest thing to accept when you're trying to change, but that's part of the, what I like to say all the time is this shit's hard. This isn't easy, it's uncomfortable. When I worked with my coach, mm-hmm. The best things that came out of me we're in my worst times. Yep. We're in the times where I was so uncomfortable. Like she asked me a few sessions in what, what works the best, well, I hate to say it, but when you push me to a point where I'm very uncomfortable, I feel that's where I make the most progress. And that's kind of, that's, that's part of it, that's the uncomfortable thing, is being able to say, Hey, I need to make some big freaking changes in my life. And unfortunately, that's probably gonna include saying bye to a few people. Yeah. And, and we don't have to say, we're saying bye outta love. We're just, we're just not quite spending as much time. Yeah. And it's not anything about them. I think one of the things that, that most beautiful things I've learned in this process is to have a different conversation with my parents than I ever, and my mom's, obviously she's here, but she's in a different spot than I ever dreamed of having. And it made it so much better to say to them in a certain way. When we're pushing ourselves outside of our comfort zone, our parents suddenly become like, we're being different than what they wanted us to be or what we thought they wanted us to be, would be a better way to say it.'cause technically our parents want us to succeed beyond them. Right? But they also wanna keep us safe. So, so the, the conversation of, uh, mom and dad, I, I honor you and I love you. And because of that, I step into my calling and because of that I'm figuring this out. And yes, it's not gonna feel safe sometimes'cause it's different, but I'm doing that because I honor you and because I love you. And I learned that down here. And there's a, there's a reverence in Mexico for your ancestors. And um, yeah, there was a coach that I had that lives him here in Mexico and. There's something that's very, there's just a huge reverence for their, an ancestors here, for the Mayans. Uh, I live in the Riviera May era area in the Yucatan, so south of, uh, PTO, Carmen. And this is an area that's very much Mayan. There's all kinds of different, uh, ruins and, and everything is, and even the names are Mayan. And so there's just this, even in say, some of their ceremonies that they do, they, that's a part of it where they think their ancestors and, but I was working with a coach on, over the last year, just kind of deconstructing some of my childhood stuff. And she offered to me that if I resist anything from the programming I got from my parents, that I'm actually causing it to cycle again and again. Right. So to reframe that, what we did is this conversation of mom and dad, I honor you and I love you, and because I honor you and I love you, I step into this calling that I'm being asked to move into. And, and then we close with the same thing. And, and just like leaving everything that's their struggle at their feet. Not, not because they deserve it, but because it's not mine. And I, I don't need to carry it around anymore. So I, I really appreciated that. Yeah. I like that. Like a, um, like a very reverent version of mm-hmm. This is not my circus. Those are your monkeys. Yeah. Yep. I hope you enjoy them. I have. I love these other monkeys. Yes, exactly. Yep. Yep. I love that. Yep. Yep. Yeah, I think when, when we, when we talk about making, making big changes, like, you know, back when we started this, I was like, that book title has the f word in it that is going to be a great self-help book for me. And Uhhuh. Sarah and I cycled through, I don't know, six or seven. We got into, we got into this one and then we were Atomic Habits and we were, uh, we were let them for a half a heartbeat. Second. I mean, but no, it's the fir Those first three were the ones, yeah. Like wait, and, and constantly we're looking for, um, should, alright, well, tell me what I should do. Tell me what I should do. Tell me what I do next. Yeah. Tell, give me, do you have a checklist? Is there a workbook? Oh, if we have a workbook, we'll definitely be able to, to change our lives. And it, it, it turns out in order to change your life, you really need to. Just do the work, put in the, the work, the effort, the willingness to be uncomfortable, the willingness to understand that if you would like your life to be different, you're going to have to act different and do things different. And how you get there is a lot of where it, you know, the hard stuff happens. No one can tell you exactly how no one's got a, no one's got a checklist for you. Unless that checklist my C does, unless that checklist is, I love a good freaking checklist too. Get ready to be uncomfortable in these 50 ways. Like, yes, but. You know, even, even if that checklist is, it'd be uncomfortable, you're, you're gonna have to, you're gonna have to put yourself there. You're gonna have to, like, you can't, you can't get up to the point of, oh yeah, checklist says I should do X, but X seems super hard and there's another self-help book right over there that I could just read that one. So you we're, we are trying to avoid the situation where we, we just keep getting the same advice and keep ignoring. Mm-hmm. The same advice. So how do you make sure that the growth happens as a coach? How do you empower people to be like, look, I know it's hard and I know that you are go, I am gonna be uncomfortable. You're gonna be uncomfortable. Everything is going to potentially feel terrible for a minute, but we're gonna get past it. How do you, how do you get people to do that? What's your, what's the secret sauce? Sarah will steal it and put it into hers. Yeah, yeah. No, she won't. I swear she has her own stuff. Well, we live in a world where, um, where. There's no IP in this space anymore. I, I'd love to give everyone all the things that we've learned and hopefully you would try some of'em out and give'em back to me and perfect it. Yeah, right. We're going into a space here that's that none of us really know what we're doing and we're just experimenting. And I mean, I think when you have a meeting, and Sarah, you're gonna understand this easily when you create enough emotional space that the person understands that when they arrive, it's all about them. And then you're gonna build some trust. I mean, this, we could use this concept for every relationship that we have. I know I'm still working on giving my wife enough sp, uh, emotional space, right? Like it's, I I am learning 20 years, 30 years too late. But, you know, still, I'm, I'm learning now that there's certain things about the way she needs to process the conversation. And I, for some reason never figured this out before. Right. It's hard. Again, shit's hard. So, so that's a good place to start is, I mean, I remember one story, my coach, whose name is Mark, and he, he had, he would, he did a lot of these disc things where he would show up and talk to people about their disc, but he'd give'em a chance to tell their story. Every single one of them. And this one lady, it was, she broke down and just basically was like, I haven't told anyone, but I was raped last week. And he's like, what? But that's the kind of thing that happens when you show up and someone senses like, oh my goodness, this person's actually here for me. And, um, obviously he didn't help her with, well, I'm sure he did help as much as he could, but I obviously he would've told her to, to get some help, um, to, to process that. But yeah, that's, that's the kind of stuff that comes up automatically. I think if we're aware of, if we're doing the work ourselves, that's the most important. If I stop doing the work, even 10 years after starting, and I'm showing up to calls and, and not continuing my own work, then I'm not gonna show up I would in a vulnerable space if I am. And that's, that's the biggest difference between an entry level coach and an advanced coach, is understanding how much there is ongoing and getting that team in place. And if I could do anything over, starting with my much bigger bank account would be, I would start there. I would build my team. And recognize and figure out how to get this in my mind that I need to, to continue the work and figure that out. How am I gonna, um, create that plan to continue my own work? And I think that would've been a little bit easier, but maybe I couldn't have done it faster, which is completely fine too. Like I needed a lot of time to, to get out of my work addiction for, for the beginning, you know? Yes. It's very hard. Yes. I was, that was one of the things that my coach would always tell me though. She just, she was very adamant that she would never give me any sort of assignment or push, like she did everything that she did with me, she had experienced, she had worked through, or however you wanna put it. And I thought that was, that was pretty, I don't. Comforting, I guess. Mm-hmm. As a, as a client, like knowing that that she's been there. Yeah. And that she was kind of in the same situation, even though our stories are very different. So I think that that's, that's something I hope to continue. Mm-hmm. Along my practice. I don't have any plans to suggest anything too crazy'cause I haven't done anything too crazy yet, so. Mm-hmm. But, but yeah, I think I agree with you. That's one of the things is that I feel as a coach that we can never stop working on ourselves if we're not working on ourselves and we're not continuing to grow and push ourselves. I don't think it's very fair that we ask other people to do it. That's just me, you know? And I have a half a client, so, yeah. I mean, like, don't, don't, um, undervalue that, uh, a lot of, one thing I I work on a lot is working with women to want women entrepreneurs to let go of all the stigmas that make it so that it's. Hard to do this and whatever stage you're at, if you're doing it, just, I mean, be thankful that you're there because it's, it's pretty hard. And it, and it's the same issue for guys, it's just a different set of issues. The whole idea, I mean, one of my biggest things is the money thing, right? Like, you gotta this, I have to, I used to do a lot of sales in tech and it's, okay, so let's, let's create what we're doing and then let's sell it. No, that's not what works in this space. We have to be it. And then by being it, we can put it out there. So we all, we all have our own stuff to work through past life. Some sometimes inherited issues that have to do with, and, and even cultural issues that have to do with a woman being in charge of something. Which, yeah, I mean, that, that was, that's been a big struggle for my wife. She's the, she's the CEOI report to her. So, um, that, but that's the perfect situation for her to address the things. She gets big visions in life. She's the visionary. And, um, yeah, the rest of us have to help her through that process and get to what really is what she wants to do and, um, and then do it for alongside of her. Yeah. That's, um, again, uh, I feel we've, uh, uh, we've come full circle here a couple of times. Oftentimes I'm the only girl in the room, uh, oftentimes I'm the, I'm the one who, uh, you know, has to say things. Let's go, let's, uh, come on. Let's, let's get it done. And like the traditional, uh, you know, kind of. Girl cheerleader things aren't necessarily gonna work or resonate with the people that I gotta motivate. So you gotta kind of figure out, all right, well, I guess I'm not gonna be the cheerleader in this case. I'm gonna be the um, uh, loud mouth sort of truck driver. And again, kind of getting back to my chameleon kind of personality, just gotta figure out what's gonna, and kind of step away from, oh, I can't do that because I'm, you know, I'm just a girl. I'm just a girl. Mm-hmm. And it, that took, I don't know. Still, still, I'll find myself like defaulting to, Hey guys, come on, let's, let me grab these, these pom-poms and let's talk about how we can have a pep rally. I was just gonna say, I could see you with pompoms, right? Yeah. But that's not the thing that's gonna capture anybody's attention. You showing up and throwing around a well-placed FBO is gonna be the thing that makes people go. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Right. You need to make that face.'cause we need to get going. Mm-hmm. Yeah, and we've, uh, we've, you know, it, it gets back to a lot of the stuff that we've talked about is finding out who, who you are and who you can bring to it that's maybe a little bit different than what you're traditionally supposed to do in those situations. Take note, Becca. Save yourself like 20 years of s There you go. I'll toss mine out. I think one of the cool things about today is that people, I don't, Rebecca, Rebecca, I don't know how old you are, so, um, but I'm 23. Okay. So people your age and younger, they actually, they get this stuff. They, they, they were born with it. A lot of them cheaters and so they're, one thing that I've really grown to learn as a dad of six boys is that, um, you know. Little kids when they're so a little baby, that's a more spiritual version of a human being than the adult. And if we wanna learn something from someone, go find a kid, they're spiritual, right? Like, they actually get things. And so we, we built a society in the US that's actually the exact backwards. Um, it's just, it doesn't work because we're trying to teach all of our kids what we needed to succeed. The last generation, this has probably always been this way. It wasn't just the us but the thing is like, we're so safety focused and so fear based that it's gotta stop. We can't, it's not gonna work. So we can start paying attention to our kids. This is, so we, we read a book, uh, the name of the book is Summer Hill and it's about a, a school in the middle of the UK summer. And in the 1950s, like this is 70 years ago, they were doing this stuff. Uh, they had a boarding school where the kids picked what they wanted to do, and it's quite amazing. The thing I love about the book is the author and the person that had the school and designed the school, he told you about the disadvantages to his plan. Like he was honest and vulnerable about it, and there was some things that didn't go so great, but ultimately they had a, they got the kids that didn't fit in, that were the rule breakers. And, and so it's very impressive and that's what we've done with our kids. We do soul school. We focus on not what's going to, what we think might work in the future, but we allow them to pick what they're gonna do. And, uh, it's quite amazing. To watch what my 5-year-old, he's like a language, a language expert. Um, I have, I feel sometimes I feel we've taught him almost nothing, and yet he learns it through the air. I I have no idea how he does it. He, he can, of course, he's got a great memory and he, he does a lot of different games and stuff on, you know, on the switch or whatever, but he, he'll read the screen partially because he probably heard it from someone on a YouTube video or something. But also he, he learned the alphabet by himself. He, um, he's amazing. And he's the one that we've let, like from, we worked with him from when he was in the womb, like energetically, and so we've really. Done the opposite, like let him lead and we're the ones that are supporting him from day one. And it's, it's amazing to watch. And now he's probably, there's probably some gifted things about him too, but that's what makes it amazing to watch. And, and all of us are that way. Right? He's, he is a little bit like you in that Christine is, what's your name? It says Chris, but I, I don't know Christine. Mm-hmm. Christine. Okay. Yeah. I call her Christine. I call her sissy too, so I probably don't know. Yeah. Okay. I was, I'm named challenged. So anyway, she, he's so people oriented. Like he could be one of those streamers that just talks nonstop. He does to all of us. He is, he's just this chatty person that goes around the house and just engages everyone and everything. Right. And anyway, so, but what I would say to you, Sarah, as a coach. Find a friend in your network that does something like healing, energy healing or something, do a session with someone together, and this is what we started to do. Take pe, take your different gifts that you offer someone get, just experiment with this. Have a session where you can talk about what's going on in someone's life and also, and do this with someone that's done some work for a while so they, they know how to be vulnerable. And also with someone that can help you with limiting beliefs and have fun with that. To me, it's the best because what happens is, this is why I do what I do, is I, I needed all this help. And then I started to realize, oh, I can do this. And so I started to learn mostly. Like in it, I had every certification test that I ever, you know, dreamt of getting. But I don't do that here. I, I do have a couple certifications. I've, I've mostly though learn from people. It's just helps me not engage my knowledge side and more my intuitive side. But I, that's what we are experimenting with. And what we're building in our team is where we take people that have these different gifts. We like to pair someone that's got the gift of discernment, usually the coach with someone that's, um, more emotional and more like a healer. And we put those two together and then see what happens with supporting our clients. And so far we've loved it. I think it's, I love that. Yeah. It's a concept. Like if you think about, um, I'm from the Midwest Mayo Clinic. What they did with doctors is putting all the experts in one room and talking with the, what the patient quote unquote. Instead of having one doctor, and then the other one and the other one come all day, they put them together and talk together. And that's kind of the concept of what we're doing of like, um, I, I mean, we could put a hypnotist and a healer and a coach in the room or whatever, whatever's appropriate and just dive into what's possible. And that's what I think it's when it gets really fun, is when you allow yourself to start experimenting with the concept of doing work. And to what Christine is saying, as long as we're doing that work, we're, we're in the same, like there's something that's connecting us, all of us doing work together. It's just like we get to have the real thing that we want in life. Yeah. I love that. It's so a, again, I am, uh, just gobsmacked. If I could use the word gobsmacked'cause I think we're gonna have to bring it back. Becca, take note. Uh, we're gonna bring gobs back. Back. We even know really what gobs, like where does it, where did did it come from? What does it really mean? Hearsay? Which cookies? Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. So that came up and smacked somebody else right in the face with a big sandwich cookie. Is that what hap I was thinking cob stoppers. No, no. Yeah, me too. It's kind of a word that makes you think of many things at once. Right? Right. I'm, I'm, it's very weird. I'm on for it. Okay, go ahead. But you know, it's so. It, it, everything is so interesting and it's interconnectedness. Olivia comes into my office today and she's, Hey, what do you know, what do you know about chakras? And I'm like, nothing. Where would I ever find a chakra? And she's like, look at these memes. Sounds painful. Mm-hmm. Look at these memes I've downloaded. So she's talking to her roommate Mary and Mary's going through some stuff, and she's like, listen, look at these, look at these things. Let's talk about it. And I, you know, for the first time in like a hundred years, I was like, you know, maybe I opened my mind up to something that isn't, that isn't, you know, a, a cut and dry kind of thing. And I'll, yeah. I'm like, yes, send it to me. Show it to me. Let me see what's, let me see what's happening. And then Kevin, to hear you talking about combining healing with doing actual work and just having a bit of that sort of like open-mindedness to, to some of these things like. Earlier in our podcast, we were really touching on meditation, really touching on, you know, ways to, ways to affect your consciousness that mm-hmm. For, for us, always tied back into taking, taking an action, looking at something and taking an action, looking at something and taking an action. But it, you know, kind of having that open-mindedness to say, yeah, look at, look at, look at the, the chakra or whatever it is that, that leads you to do, I think is the, is the place where, where we came to, you know, some, some kind of overlap with those things. But again, gobsmack to that, Olivia's in my office talking about doing some of this. And then, and then you're here talking about how like collectively working on a person in, in ways that, that may be unexpected, like. And a theme throughout my day to day has been working with different groups of people that make me wanna throat punch them, but are also necessary for us to get our stuff done like it is, um, again, kind of, kind of wild, the way the universe lines up sometimes. So I will leave. They are chakra specific for throat punching? Yeah, the throat chakra. Yeah, I think it's right here. Okay. I think it's this one. Okay. Listen, you know, I'm just new. I'm just a baby here, so, but Kevin, is that, is that kind of like what, does chakras have anything to do with what you're talking about or I just making up connections in my head. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Actually, uh, we could connect posts to what I talk about with, with chakras. Not actually, not because it's the center, but it's just related. Like, um, I learned. Maybe that my energy mentor, I dunno if he talked about chakras too much, but I tried to learn about what, what he was doing because he wasn't, he wasn't like a teacher so much. He was more of like, Hey, do you know you could do this? And um, so I found someone, her name is Cindy Dale, and she's amazing. I've taken some of her classes and actually just purchased one the other day. I need to get started on, on physical healing. And she, um, she talks a lot about, she's done a lot of integration across multiple cultures, so she's fun to talk to because what you find out if you start to look into shocker systems and stuff like that is there's different ones. And so it's like, well, which one is real? Right. Um, I like Cindy because she's done, she's. Gone and talked to people and really kind of understood. There's slightly different perspectives, but pretty much everyone agrees it's just that you have to get past the slight differences. And so she's done that and then published books to explain like why. And Cindy is, um, speaking of someone that's, you know, she was, her mother was physically abused while she was in the womb, and she's one of the rare people that knows, like she remembers the womb. Um, because she was not in a place of safety, she was also part of that experience. And, um, and a lot of, I don't know, like whether she was gifted before that and then she was more gifted. I don't know how that all works, but like, she's hugely gifted. Like she's one of those people that can see, um. See your chakras, see your aura. Like she chakras are actually pretty complicated when you think about them in reality and she can see them in detail. Sorry, hit my mic. Um, she can, happens all the time. See your aura. She does a lot with working on the aura. And the aura is a place that can hold a lot of stuff. Trauma from, um, even your parents, uh, things that aren't even ours we take on because we're so kind and loving people. And yeah, she can see all that. She can see so much and just very gifted. And so she teaches other people all kinds of things about the spiritual realm and, and how to work with people. One of the things she teaches is, um, healing is, is really like just returning things to the way that they're meant to be. It's not any rocket scientist. Right? And, and really we're supposed, like, that's something that we are meant to know. We're all healers. We can all receive healing and um, obviously we have different approaches. Um, but yeah, healing is, is just, it's honestly, it's just receiving love. Um, what, what causes a, a problem in the body? Like if you look at the science of this, right? There's this book called The Biology of Belief, and there's a stem cell researcher you can get into this stuff. Um, Bruce Lipton, Dr. Bruce Lipton was at, I believe, uh, university of Madison, Wisconsin. And, um, he was trying to tie gene genes to disease, but he absolutely failed and ended up quitting the whole place because he, he proved that the environment, he had two, two Petri dishes. The cells differed depending on the energy that was around them. And so he basically said he, he tried to commence his whole group, uh, the whole faculty that, Hey, we're wrong. We gotta like start paying attention to this. And they kicked him out. And, um, anyway, um, so there's more to that story I am sure than what I took out of it. But we, our energy, everything about us, um, really we're meant to be a source of love. We are love. That's a hard part. That maybe the hardest thing. That's what the work really is, is to come to grips with that, to learn, to love ourselves, to accept that we are love. That's a tough one, especially for a lot of us that came from a Christian background. Nothing against that background. It's just like somehow we, there's some stuff that isn't quite true that we tend to believe and it's. If you actually know the truth, then you can go back and kind of understand where we went wrong on some of it, right? Um, it's not really that it, the teach the source teaching's wrong. It's what we've done with it. But that being said, we're also all of our chakras, what they're there for is to process energy. The primarily and most powerful energy to, for them to process is love and, and good energy, right? So what happens when you have limiting beliefs or you have emotions trapped in your body, or you have other things, you block it and suddenly you're not, you're not loving yourself in some way, right? So, for example, this is a simple example in your root chakra, we are meant to be connected to our environment in a powerful, thankful, and appreciative way That includes our job. And if we sort force ourselves to do the work that we don't actually like doing, and if we are in an environment that's not supportive, we're traumatizing our root chakra. So, um, and the, the earth is a center of love as well. The heavens are the, you know, unconditional love from God or however you wanna think about it, than from the earth and from ourselves. And so the root chakra goes into the earth, grounds us, connects us to that love and we're meant to. Right outside my window, before I got on the podcast, there was a monkey. I was watching him and I, what a monkey outside my window. No, you don't. I love live in the jungle. Sorry, Kevin. I mean, there's some really bad things about, I mean, I have that monkey, but yeah, I mean, there's some bad things about living in the jungle, by the way. I mean, we have scorpions, we have huge spiders. We have millions of ants that decide to go, you know what, sorry, I'm great with that. I'm perfectly fine with that monkey. And I'm like, Amazon boss. If someone would've told me this, I wouldn't live here. But I'm glad I do and I've learned to love spiders actually. Yeah, whatever. It's a long story. I won't get into it, but I, I, I'm learning to love even the strangest things. I have not figured out how to love scorpion. I'm fine with no, pretty much killing those. They don't seem to have good energy, but spiders actually do, and I've hated spiders all my life anyway, so, yeah. No, I love, IIII love that my, my daughter is like, no, look, you, you, Sarah, we've talked about how you feel when you feel depressed and you're like, this is a physical thing. And Olivia's like, if you look at these, these chakra pictures, this iss where you feel this shit, and she's like, this is where I feel this particular thing, and I Awesome. She is really like, that's huge. Trying to tease out and that's good. What's OCD? What's a DD? What's depression? What are, what are, what is suicidal ideation versus what's an intrusive thought? And she's like, all of those things get caught, like in these different places on me. And maybe I can use that as a clue to what, how worried I should be about each of these individual things. And, you know, combining that with her therapy, that's amazing. And her medication, I'm like, Hey, I, there's, there's no reason not to, there's no reason Yeah. That you should cut that off because it's a little bit non-traditional. I mean, look at, and that's really hard to do. I may have to talk to her because I, that's one of the things that I have so much trouble with, with, because with my meditation practice and, and using. The breath work, the breathing that I do, that's one of the things I've been trying so hard, is to be able to pinpoint where I feel whatever emotion is happening. Mm-hmm. And I have a really hard time going anywhere, but right here, it's just all in my shoulders. All of my emotions are just right here. Mm. Responsibility. And I try to not responsibility. Right. I try to not be like there like that. That's wrong.'cause I know in meditation, like there's, you're not doing it wrong, but there's a part of my brain that's like everybody else is talking about their feeling things here and here and here. And literally every freaking emotion I have, it's just everything hits right here. Mm-hmm. What's, why isn't that wrong? Why would that be wrong? And that's what I mean, I just, because I feel everybody else feels like so all over the place like Libby is, and so I feel like there's something I'm not digging deep enough into. I feel everything. I'm forcing everything here instead of just, well, there's a lot of, lots of, lot of possibilities. Um, I mean, and there could and who cares, right? We don't need to judge it. Yeah. I mean, seriously don't, yeah, I'm with what Christine was saying, like we don't need to judge the Yeah. But like, and that's what I've been just you bringing it up, Christine, just talking about like that's Yeah, I came across this. I don't care. Um, amazing. Uh, definitely responsibility that, so probably you've got something. So there's certain parts of what we can let go that you can do through breath work and you don't need to know what it was like certain emotions. There's also also things though that we need to know about and talk about to let go. And so you need a mo modality that can expose what it is and have the conversation where you dig deep enough with that. Right. And sometimes you even need something. Like, for me, I needed to get started in this. I needed hypno. Um, which hypno is nothing like what you see on this, on the, on the stage. Cluck like a chicken or No, no. It's like being hyper aware. It's, it's similar. I use a methodology called theta healing, which is very similar. You go into theta brainwave, which is way more easy for you to, and it's a hyper awareness, I would say, like in a positive way. It feels like, like amazing place of love. Right. So it's not like a freaky, psychedelic drug. No, I, and that's, I'm just kidding. But yeah, it's, it's a good place. Yeah. I, I'm, I'm one of those people that doesn't, don't think that you need help with doing this. I, I don't think you need drugs or anything. Yeah. I mean, there is a lot of people that do that, and I'm not like, gonna speak against'em. I know what they're doing. I, I don't, I haven't tried that method, so I just have to say that, which, going back to the shit that's crazy and connected, I literally just saw something today about psychedelic therapy or something. So Go ahead. I was like, mm-hmm. Oh, all right. Okay. Go it. Yeah. I think someday I'm gonna have to change, try it, because I don't know, without trying it, but I, but I don't really have an interest at this point. No. Sorry, I totally threw us off there. Yeah. I, I think this is, this is, this is a, this is a great place to kind of like get to in that, you know. Do just what Olivia said. She's like, the, here's, here's what it, because, uh, my daughter wants to be a neuroscientist. She wants to figure out how do we tease apart OCD from, from a d, d, how do I, how do I figure out which one of these things it is? And I'm like, open. Open yourself up to lots of stuff. Right now I'm like, you're a junior in college. You still have a whole two whole years left of mm-hmm. Book learning. And then, and then you'll end up in graduate school somewhere and go someplace where people are doing cool research. Look, look into all of it. Mm-hmm. Like, yeah. And she tried to, she tried to self-help herself when she was like 12, 13. She's like, I'm just gonna be a witch. And that will, I remember that I'm gonna collect all of these, she rock crystals and put them all over my house. Right. We're gonna just collect all of these rocks and we're gonna put'em out in the moonlight or the sunlight or whatever, and then we're gonna, um, I'm gonna throw rosemary around my room and that will fix me. And I'm like, Hey, that's awesome. Maybe pick some of that back up and figure out is there, is there anything to it? And like there's nothing, you're not gonna hurt anything. No, I don't think, like you're not gonna hurt yourself. No, I mean the good news on this stuff is we can learn a lot of that stuff for fairly cheap. Like you can go to cindy dale.com with a, Cindy with an ISYD, I don't know if I could spell it. S-S-Y-N-D-I dale.com. DAL e.com. And I got the Dale, right? Yeah. The other part of it. I did that right. And just buy a couple hundred dollars class about chakras and she, she's an expert like I'll For sure. That's amazing. Kevin, before we let you go, is there anything we didn't ask you that you wanna talk about? I am thoroughly satisfied and with all the conversation it was beautiful. Thank you very much for having me. Um, bye.